What are the ramifications of creating a homebrew world without an Astral Plane?What are all the ways a player can get to the Astral Plane?What happened to the Barrens of Doom and Despair during and after the Spellplague?Did the spellplague change the cosmology of other crystal spheres too, or just realmspace?What D&D creatures are the most appropriate to act as mercenaries?Can Gated Fiends/Celestials Die Permanently?Is there a Forgotten Realms campaign setting book for D&D 5e?What differentiates “Gods” from other entities in the Forgotten Realm cosmology?What rules are there for deciding what specific items to award when the loot table is unclear?Are the Material Planes comprising the various campaign settings surrounded by a shared set of outer planes?In an auction, how might magic item collectors in other lands bid remotely?How much would an average adventurer in the Forgotten Realms know about the Great Wheel Cosmology?

Is there a good way to store credentials outside of a password manager?

Lay out the Carpet

Increase performance creating Mandelbrot set in python

Have I saved too much for retirement so far?

Are there any comparative studies done between Ashtavakra Gita and Buddhim?

Can criminal fraud exist without damages?

Time travel short story where a man arrives in the late 19th century in a time machine and then sends the machine back into the past

How could Frankenstein get the parts for his _second_ creature?

Opposite of a diet

What would happen if the UK refused to take part in EU Parliamentary elections?

What will be the benefits of Brexit?

HashMap containsKey() returns false although hashCode() and equals() are true

Irreducibility of a simple polynomial

What is the opposite of 'gravitas'?

How to prove that the query oracle is unitary?

Best way to store options for panels

Efficiently merge handle parallel feature branches in SFDX

Is there any reason not to eat food that's been dropped on the surface of the moon?

Failed to fetch jessie backports repository

Applicability of Single Responsibility Principle

Coordinate position not precise

Greatest common substring

Minimal reference content

Tiptoe or tiphoof? Adjusting words to better fit fantasy races



What are the ramifications of creating a homebrew world without an Astral Plane?


What are all the ways a player can get to the Astral Plane?What happened to the Barrens of Doom and Despair during and after the Spellplague?Did the spellplague change the cosmology of other crystal spheres too, or just realmspace?What D&D creatures are the most appropriate to act as mercenaries?Can Gated Fiends/Celestials Die Permanently?Is there a Forgotten Realms campaign setting book for D&D 5e?What differentiates “Gods” from other entities in the Forgotten Realm cosmology?What rules are there for deciding what specific items to award when the loot table is unclear?Are the Material Planes comprising the various campaign settings surrounded by a shared set of outer planes?In an auction, how might magic item collectors in other lands bid remotely?How much would an average adventurer in the Forgotten Realms know about the Great Wheel Cosmology?













6












$begingroup$


I'm currently working on a homebrew world for a campaign of mine, which is currently on hold. We played a few sessions before some of our newer players decided that D&D wasn't for them, and I figured out that I want to DM a less Forgotten-Realms-clone-like world.

Overall design intent:



  1. I don't want to have a 1:1 identical world to the Forgotten
    Realms, with the only difference being the Material Plane,



  2. I'm not entirely content with the planar cosmology and pantheons
    in the Forgotten Realms.



    Since I personally don't like the Astral Plane in particular, I'm thinking about outright removing it from my world.



However, the DMG states on page 43 on "The Planes":




At minimum, most D&D campaigns require these elements:



  • [...]

  • A way of getting from one plane to another

  • A way for spells and monsters that use the Astral Plane and the Ethereal Plane to function



Obviously, I don't have to adhere to these guidelines. However, I'm aware that a number of spells, creatures, magical items and other things in 5e directly refer to the Astral Plane. Miniman's answer to the question What are all the ways a player can get to the Astral Plane? lists quite a few of these.



Naturally, spells (like Astral Projection), creatures (including playable races like Gith) or magical objects that refer to the Astral Plane simply don't exist (in unmodified form) in this campaign. I'd homebrew something for what happens when you put e.g. two Bags of Holding into each other.



I also know that the Astral Plane can be used as a means of travelling between different worlds, using the color pools located on it. I'm thinking about implementing a Yggdrasil-style World Tree in my world, which would assume this job.



Are there any other ramifications as a result of not having an Astral Plane in a 5e campaign setting?






dnd-5e homebrew planes world-building astral







share|improve this question











$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    initally, tier 1 or 2. However, the world will serve as a setting for all tiers, so the PC's level shouldn't really be relevant.
    $endgroup$
    – PixelMaster
    4 hours ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Just as an aside, the Astral Plane was a thing long before FR became a setting. It was in the AD&D 1e books a a thing. (Greyhawk default world if we view E Gygax as creator, and there were references to it in the OD&D supplements). Thus your reference to FR is irrelevant to the question. The astral plane touches most settings in one way or another. Suggest you edit your question to remove FR reference (it will make for a tighter/cleaner question). Also suggest you tighten your title: what are the mechanical effects of not having an Astral Plane in my setting. Up to you.
    $endgroup$
    – KorvinStarmast
    4 hours ago







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Title seems fine imho.
    $endgroup$
    – Quadratic Wizard
    3 hours ago















6












$begingroup$


I'm currently working on a homebrew world for a campaign of mine, which is currently on hold. We played a few sessions before some of our newer players decided that D&D wasn't for them, and I figured out that I want to DM a less Forgotten-Realms-clone-like world.

Overall design intent:



  1. I don't want to have a 1:1 identical world to the Forgotten
    Realms, with the only difference being the Material Plane,



  2. I'm not entirely content with the planar cosmology and pantheons
    in the Forgotten Realms.



    Since I personally don't like the Astral Plane in particular, I'm thinking about outright removing it from my world.



However, the DMG states on page 43 on "The Planes":




At minimum, most D&D campaigns require these elements:



  • [...]

  • A way of getting from one plane to another

  • A way for spells and monsters that use the Astral Plane and the Ethereal Plane to function



Obviously, I don't have to adhere to these guidelines. However, I'm aware that a number of spells, creatures, magical items and other things in 5e directly refer to the Astral Plane. Miniman's answer to the question What are all the ways a player can get to the Astral Plane? lists quite a few of these.



Naturally, spells (like Astral Projection), creatures (including playable races like Gith) or magical objects that refer to the Astral Plane simply don't exist (in unmodified form) in this campaign. I'd homebrew something for what happens when you put e.g. two Bags of Holding into each other.



I also know that the Astral Plane can be used as a means of travelling between different worlds, using the color pools located on it. I'm thinking about implementing a Yggdrasil-style World Tree in my world, which would assume this job.



Are there any other ramifications as a result of not having an Astral Plane in a 5e campaign setting?






dnd-5e homebrew planes world-building astral







share|improve this question











$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    initally, tier 1 or 2. However, the world will serve as a setting for all tiers, so the PC's level shouldn't really be relevant.
    $endgroup$
    – PixelMaster
    4 hours ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Just as an aside, the Astral Plane was a thing long before FR became a setting. It was in the AD&D 1e books a a thing. (Greyhawk default world if we view E Gygax as creator, and there were references to it in the OD&D supplements). Thus your reference to FR is irrelevant to the question. The astral plane touches most settings in one way or another. Suggest you edit your question to remove FR reference (it will make for a tighter/cleaner question). Also suggest you tighten your title: what are the mechanical effects of not having an Astral Plane in my setting. Up to you.
    $endgroup$
    – KorvinStarmast
    4 hours ago







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Title seems fine imho.
    $endgroup$
    – Quadratic Wizard
    3 hours ago













6












6








6





$begingroup$


I'm currently working on a homebrew world for a campaign of mine, which is currently on hold. We played a few sessions before some of our newer players decided that D&D wasn't for them, and I figured out that I want to DM a less Forgotten-Realms-clone-like world.

Overall design intent:



  1. I don't want to have a 1:1 identical world to the Forgotten
    Realms, with the only difference being the Material Plane,



  2. I'm not entirely content with the planar cosmology and pantheons
    in the Forgotten Realms.



    Since I personally don't like the Astral Plane in particular, I'm thinking about outright removing it from my world.



However, the DMG states on page 43 on "The Planes":




At minimum, most D&D campaigns require these elements:



  • [...]

  • A way of getting from one plane to another

  • A way for spells and monsters that use the Astral Plane and the Ethereal Plane to function



Obviously, I don't have to adhere to these guidelines. However, I'm aware that a number of spells, creatures, magical items and other things in 5e directly refer to the Astral Plane. Miniman's answer to the question What are all the ways a player can get to the Astral Plane? lists quite a few of these.



Naturally, spells (like Astral Projection), creatures (including playable races like Gith) or magical objects that refer to the Astral Plane simply don't exist (in unmodified form) in this campaign. I'd homebrew something for what happens when you put e.g. two Bags of Holding into each other.



I also know that the Astral Plane can be used as a means of travelling between different worlds, using the color pools located on it. I'm thinking about implementing a Yggdrasil-style World Tree in my world, which would assume this job.



Are there any other ramifications as a result of not having an Astral Plane in a 5e campaign setting?






dnd-5e homebrew planes world-building astral







share|improve this question











$endgroup$




I'm currently working on a homebrew world for a campaign of mine, which is currently on hold. We played a few sessions before some of our newer players decided that D&D wasn't for them, and I figured out that I want to DM a less Forgotten-Realms-clone-like world.

Overall design intent:



  1. I don't want to have a 1:1 identical world to the Forgotten
    Realms, with the only difference being the Material Plane,



  2. I'm not entirely content with the planar cosmology and pantheons
    in the Forgotten Realms.



    Since I personally don't like the Astral Plane in particular, I'm thinking about outright removing it from my world.



However, the DMG states on page 43 on "The Planes":




At minimum, most D&D campaigns require these elements:



  • [...]

  • A way of getting from one plane to another

  • A way for spells and monsters that use the Astral Plane and the Ethereal Plane to function



Obviously, I don't have to adhere to these guidelines. However, I'm aware that a number of spells, creatures, magical items and other things in 5e directly refer to the Astral Plane. Miniman's answer to the question What are all the ways a player can get to the Astral Plane? lists quite a few of these.



Naturally, spells (like Astral Projection), creatures (including playable races like Gith) or magical objects that refer to the Astral Plane simply don't exist (in unmodified form) in this campaign. I'd homebrew something for what happens when you put e.g. two Bags of Holding into each other.



I also know that the Astral Plane can be used as a means of travelling between different worlds, using the color pools located on it. I'm thinking about implementing a Yggdrasil-style World Tree in my world, which would assume this job.



Are there any other ramifications as a result of not having an Astral Plane in a 5e campaign setting?






dnd-5e homebrew planes world-building astral




dnd-5e homebrew planes world-building astral






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited 4 hours ago









KorvinStarmast

82.5k20257444




82.5k20257444










asked 7 hours ago









PixelMasterPixelMaster

12.2k346113




12.2k346113











  • $begingroup$
    initally, tier 1 or 2. However, the world will serve as a setting for all tiers, so the PC's level shouldn't really be relevant.
    $endgroup$
    – PixelMaster
    4 hours ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Just as an aside, the Astral Plane was a thing long before FR became a setting. It was in the AD&D 1e books a a thing. (Greyhawk default world if we view E Gygax as creator, and there were references to it in the OD&D supplements). Thus your reference to FR is irrelevant to the question. The astral plane touches most settings in one way or another. Suggest you edit your question to remove FR reference (it will make for a tighter/cleaner question). Also suggest you tighten your title: what are the mechanical effects of not having an Astral Plane in my setting. Up to you.
    $endgroup$
    – KorvinStarmast
    4 hours ago







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Title seems fine imho.
    $endgroup$
    – Quadratic Wizard
    3 hours ago
















  • $begingroup$
    initally, tier 1 or 2. However, the world will serve as a setting for all tiers, so the PC's level shouldn't really be relevant.
    $endgroup$
    – PixelMaster
    4 hours ago






  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Just as an aside, the Astral Plane was a thing long before FR became a setting. It was in the AD&D 1e books a a thing. (Greyhawk default world if we view E Gygax as creator, and there were references to it in the OD&D supplements). Thus your reference to FR is irrelevant to the question. The astral plane touches most settings in one way or another. Suggest you edit your question to remove FR reference (it will make for a tighter/cleaner question). Also suggest you tighten your title: what are the mechanical effects of not having an Astral Plane in my setting. Up to you.
    $endgroup$
    – KorvinStarmast
    4 hours ago







  • 2




    $begingroup$
    Title seems fine imho.
    $endgroup$
    – Quadratic Wizard
    3 hours ago















$begingroup$
initally, tier 1 or 2. However, the world will serve as a setting for all tiers, so the PC's level shouldn't really be relevant.
$endgroup$
– PixelMaster
4 hours ago




$begingroup$
initally, tier 1 or 2. However, the world will serve as a setting for all tiers, so the PC's level shouldn't really be relevant.
$endgroup$
– PixelMaster
4 hours ago




2




2




$begingroup$
Just as an aside, the Astral Plane was a thing long before FR became a setting. It was in the AD&D 1e books a a thing. (Greyhawk default world if we view E Gygax as creator, and there were references to it in the OD&D supplements). Thus your reference to FR is irrelevant to the question. The astral plane touches most settings in one way or another. Suggest you edit your question to remove FR reference (it will make for a tighter/cleaner question). Also suggest you tighten your title: what are the mechanical effects of not having an Astral Plane in my setting. Up to you.
$endgroup$
– KorvinStarmast
4 hours ago





$begingroup$
Just as an aside, the Astral Plane was a thing long before FR became a setting. It was in the AD&D 1e books a a thing. (Greyhawk default world if we view E Gygax as creator, and there were references to it in the OD&D supplements). Thus your reference to FR is irrelevant to the question. The astral plane touches most settings in one way or another. Suggest you edit your question to remove FR reference (it will make for a tighter/cleaner question). Also suggest you tighten your title: what are the mechanical effects of not having an Astral Plane in my setting. Up to you.
$endgroup$
– KorvinStarmast
4 hours ago





2




2




$begingroup$
Title seems fine imho.
$endgroup$
– Quadratic Wizard
3 hours ago




$begingroup$
Title seems fine imho.
$endgroup$
– Quadratic Wizard
3 hours ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















16












$begingroup$

Only the following elements in the core rulebooks use the Astral Plane



While it's impossible to list every possible Astral Plane interaction in D&D, the list of things in the three core rulebooks which rely on the Astral Plane is actually very limited.



The following spells, items or abilities allow travel to the Astral Plane, and will not have that function if the plane is removed:



  • An 18th-level monk's Timeless Body ability

  • A wild magic sorcerer's wild surge (2% chance)

  • The 9th level spell astral projection


  • Prismatic spray and prismatic wall's violet layer (can also banish to the Ethereal or another plane)

  • The Robe of Stars

  • A torn Bag of Devouring, Bag of Holding, Heward's Handy Haversack, or Portable Hole

  • Ether cyclones on the Ethereal Plane (5% chance)

The only other core rules elements which rely on that plane are as follows:



  • Souls of slain individuals traditionally travel to their final resting place via the Astral Plane. You need to invent a new reasoning for how souls get to their afterlife or the realm of their deity.

  • The Githyanki live on the Astral Plane. Without the Astral, they either don't exist or live somewhere else.


  • Forbiddance blocks planar travel, including from the Astral Plane; if you have no Astral Plane, it doesn't do that any more.

You don't need an Astral Plane



Fundamentally, you can completely ignore the Astral Plane. The only significant changes you need to make are explaining how souls and planar visitors get to the realms of the gods, explaining where stuff gets banished by certain spell effects that normally send things to the Astral, and resolving very high-level abilities that normally allow astral projection so that they work some other way.






share|improve this answer











$endgroup$




















    5












    $begingroup$

    It's impossible to cover every scenario



    You are trying to create a homebrew universe, which is awesome. I wouldn't worry too much about trying to cover all your bases but just deal with issues as they come up.



    Building an entire universe is incredibly difficult, so don't worry about covering most cases (because you probably can't.) Worry more about building an engaging world and working on inconsistencies as they come up.



    My own world and time management



    I'm currently running a campaign in my own contained world that technically doesn't have those planes, either. I haven't even really considered the issues around that and I don't plan to unless something specific comes up. There is so much more to work on that creating contingencies for every possible thing is not a good use of my worldbuilding/storybuilding/encounterbuilding time.



    It'll be a process



    Authors can spend their lifetimes building and filling out their universe. As GMs, we often don't have that luxury - especially if our players are itching to get started.



    What you need to do is fill in enough to get you started. Have your main story arc(s) outlined as well as your primary and motivating characters. But you're going to have to be flexible. Your players are going to change it, and you should let them and listen to them. Let them influence you and help build the world they are playing in. It'll likely lead to greater table satisfaction - and they're going to come up with ideas you probably wouldn't have :) And their actions can introduce new characters you hadn't thought of or new regions/worlds/planes interactions that you didn't consider.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
      $endgroup$
      – PixelMaster
      6 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
      $endgroup$
      – PixelMaster
      6 hours ago











    • $begingroup$
      @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
      $endgroup$
      – NautArch
      6 hours ago











    • $begingroup$
      @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
      $endgroup$
      – NautArch
      6 hours ago










    • $begingroup$
      I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
      $endgroup$
      – PixelMaster
      6 hours ago










    Your Answer





    StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function ()
    return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function ()
    StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix)
    StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["\$", "\$"]]);
    );
    );
    , "mathjax-editing");

    StackExchange.ready(function()
    var channelOptions =
    tags: "".split(" "),
    id: "122"
    ;
    initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

    StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
    // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
    if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
    StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
    createEditor();
    );

    else
    createEditor();

    );

    function createEditor()
    StackExchange.prepareEditor(
    heartbeatType: 'answer',
    autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
    convertImagesToLinks: false,
    noModals: true,
    showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
    reputationToPostImages: null,
    bindNavPrevention: true,
    postfix: "",
    imageUploader:
    brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
    contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
    allowUrls: true
    ,
    noCode: true, onDemand: true,
    discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
    ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
    );



    );













    draft saved

    draft discarded


















    StackExchange.ready(
    function ()
    StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2frpg.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f143972%2fwhat-are-the-ramifications-of-creating-a-homebrew-world-without-an-astral-plane%23new-answer', 'question_page');

    );

    Post as a guest















    Required, but never shown

























    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes








    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes









    16












    $begingroup$

    Only the following elements in the core rulebooks use the Astral Plane



    While it's impossible to list every possible Astral Plane interaction in D&D, the list of things in the three core rulebooks which rely on the Astral Plane is actually very limited.



    The following spells, items or abilities allow travel to the Astral Plane, and will not have that function if the plane is removed:



    • An 18th-level monk's Timeless Body ability

    • A wild magic sorcerer's wild surge (2% chance)

    • The 9th level spell astral projection


    • Prismatic spray and prismatic wall's violet layer (can also banish to the Ethereal or another plane)

    • The Robe of Stars

    • A torn Bag of Devouring, Bag of Holding, Heward's Handy Haversack, or Portable Hole

    • Ether cyclones on the Ethereal Plane (5% chance)

    The only other core rules elements which rely on that plane are as follows:



    • Souls of slain individuals traditionally travel to their final resting place via the Astral Plane. You need to invent a new reasoning for how souls get to their afterlife or the realm of their deity.

    • The Githyanki live on the Astral Plane. Without the Astral, they either don't exist or live somewhere else.


    • Forbiddance blocks planar travel, including from the Astral Plane; if you have no Astral Plane, it doesn't do that any more.

    You don't need an Astral Plane



    Fundamentally, you can completely ignore the Astral Plane. The only significant changes you need to make are explaining how souls and planar visitors get to the realms of the gods, explaining where stuff gets banished by certain spell effects that normally send things to the Astral, and resolving very high-level abilities that normally allow astral projection so that they work some other way.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$

















      16












      $begingroup$

      Only the following elements in the core rulebooks use the Astral Plane



      While it's impossible to list every possible Astral Plane interaction in D&D, the list of things in the three core rulebooks which rely on the Astral Plane is actually very limited.



      The following spells, items or abilities allow travel to the Astral Plane, and will not have that function if the plane is removed:



      • An 18th-level monk's Timeless Body ability

      • A wild magic sorcerer's wild surge (2% chance)

      • The 9th level spell astral projection


      • Prismatic spray and prismatic wall's violet layer (can also banish to the Ethereal or another plane)

      • The Robe of Stars

      • A torn Bag of Devouring, Bag of Holding, Heward's Handy Haversack, or Portable Hole

      • Ether cyclones on the Ethereal Plane (5% chance)

      The only other core rules elements which rely on that plane are as follows:



      • Souls of slain individuals traditionally travel to their final resting place via the Astral Plane. You need to invent a new reasoning for how souls get to their afterlife or the realm of their deity.

      • The Githyanki live on the Astral Plane. Without the Astral, they either don't exist or live somewhere else.


      • Forbiddance blocks planar travel, including from the Astral Plane; if you have no Astral Plane, it doesn't do that any more.

      You don't need an Astral Plane



      Fundamentally, you can completely ignore the Astral Plane. The only significant changes you need to make are explaining how souls and planar visitors get to the realms of the gods, explaining where stuff gets banished by certain spell effects that normally send things to the Astral, and resolving very high-level abilities that normally allow astral projection so that they work some other way.






      share|improve this answer











      $endgroup$















        16












        16








        16





        $begingroup$

        Only the following elements in the core rulebooks use the Astral Plane



        While it's impossible to list every possible Astral Plane interaction in D&D, the list of things in the three core rulebooks which rely on the Astral Plane is actually very limited.



        The following spells, items or abilities allow travel to the Astral Plane, and will not have that function if the plane is removed:



        • An 18th-level monk's Timeless Body ability

        • A wild magic sorcerer's wild surge (2% chance)

        • The 9th level spell astral projection


        • Prismatic spray and prismatic wall's violet layer (can also banish to the Ethereal or another plane)

        • The Robe of Stars

        • A torn Bag of Devouring, Bag of Holding, Heward's Handy Haversack, or Portable Hole

        • Ether cyclones on the Ethereal Plane (5% chance)

        The only other core rules elements which rely on that plane are as follows:



        • Souls of slain individuals traditionally travel to their final resting place via the Astral Plane. You need to invent a new reasoning for how souls get to their afterlife or the realm of their deity.

        • The Githyanki live on the Astral Plane. Without the Astral, they either don't exist or live somewhere else.


        • Forbiddance blocks planar travel, including from the Astral Plane; if you have no Astral Plane, it doesn't do that any more.

        You don't need an Astral Plane



        Fundamentally, you can completely ignore the Astral Plane. The only significant changes you need to make are explaining how souls and planar visitors get to the realms of the gods, explaining where stuff gets banished by certain spell effects that normally send things to the Astral, and resolving very high-level abilities that normally allow astral projection so that they work some other way.






        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$



        Only the following elements in the core rulebooks use the Astral Plane



        While it's impossible to list every possible Astral Plane interaction in D&D, the list of things in the three core rulebooks which rely on the Astral Plane is actually very limited.



        The following spells, items or abilities allow travel to the Astral Plane, and will not have that function if the plane is removed:



        • An 18th-level monk's Timeless Body ability

        • A wild magic sorcerer's wild surge (2% chance)

        • The 9th level spell astral projection


        • Prismatic spray and prismatic wall's violet layer (can also banish to the Ethereal or another plane)

        • The Robe of Stars

        • A torn Bag of Devouring, Bag of Holding, Heward's Handy Haversack, or Portable Hole

        • Ether cyclones on the Ethereal Plane (5% chance)

        The only other core rules elements which rely on that plane are as follows:



        • Souls of slain individuals traditionally travel to their final resting place via the Astral Plane. You need to invent a new reasoning for how souls get to their afterlife or the realm of their deity.

        • The Githyanki live on the Astral Plane. Without the Astral, they either don't exist or live somewhere else.


        • Forbiddance blocks planar travel, including from the Astral Plane; if you have no Astral Plane, it doesn't do that any more.

        You don't need an Astral Plane



        Fundamentally, you can completely ignore the Astral Plane. The only significant changes you need to make are explaining how souls and planar visitors get to the realms of the gods, explaining where stuff gets banished by certain spell effects that normally send things to the Astral, and resolving very high-level abilities that normally allow astral projection so that they work some other way.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited 3 hours ago

























        answered 4 hours ago









        Quadratic WizardQuadratic Wizard

        30.3k399164




        30.3k399164























            5












            $begingroup$

            It's impossible to cover every scenario



            You are trying to create a homebrew universe, which is awesome. I wouldn't worry too much about trying to cover all your bases but just deal with issues as they come up.



            Building an entire universe is incredibly difficult, so don't worry about covering most cases (because you probably can't.) Worry more about building an engaging world and working on inconsistencies as they come up.



            My own world and time management



            I'm currently running a campaign in my own contained world that technically doesn't have those planes, either. I haven't even really considered the issues around that and I don't plan to unless something specific comes up. There is so much more to work on that creating contingencies for every possible thing is not a good use of my worldbuilding/storybuilding/encounterbuilding time.



            It'll be a process



            Authors can spend their lifetimes building and filling out their universe. As GMs, we often don't have that luxury - especially if our players are itching to get started.



            What you need to do is fill in enough to get you started. Have your main story arc(s) outlined as well as your primary and motivating characters. But you're going to have to be flexible. Your players are going to change it, and you should let them and listen to them. Let them influence you and help build the world they are playing in. It'll likely lead to greater table satisfaction - and they're going to come up with ideas you probably wouldn't have :) And their actions can introduce new characters you hadn't thought of or new regions/worlds/planes interactions that you didn't consider.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$












            • $begingroup$
              I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago















            5












            $begingroup$

            It's impossible to cover every scenario



            You are trying to create a homebrew universe, which is awesome. I wouldn't worry too much about trying to cover all your bases but just deal with issues as they come up.



            Building an entire universe is incredibly difficult, so don't worry about covering most cases (because you probably can't.) Worry more about building an engaging world and working on inconsistencies as they come up.



            My own world and time management



            I'm currently running a campaign in my own contained world that technically doesn't have those planes, either. I haven't even really considered the issues around that and I don't plan to unless something specific comes up. There is so much more to work on that creating contingencies for every possible thing is not a good use of my worldbuilding/storybuilding/encounterbuilding time.



            It'll be a process



            Authors can spend their lifetimes building and filling out their universe. As GMs, we often don't have that luxury - especially if our players are itching to get started.



            What you need to do is fill in enough to get you started. Have your main story arc(s) outlined as well as your primary and motivating characters. But you're going to have to be flexible. Your players are going to change it, and you should let them and listen to them. Let them influence you and help build the world they are playing in. It'll likely lead to greater table satisfaction - and they're going to come up with ideas you probably wouldn't have :) And their actions can introduce new characters you hadn't thought of or new regions/worlds/planes interactions that you didn't consider.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$












            • $begingroup$
              I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago













            5












            5








            5





            $begingroup$

            It's impossible to cover every scenario



            You are trying to create a homebrew universe, which is awesome. I wouldn't worry too much about trying to cover all your bases but just deal with issues as they come up.



            Building an entire universe is incredibly difficult, so don't worry about covering most cases (because you probably can't.) Worry more about building an engaging world and working on inconsistencies as they come up.



            My own world and time management



            I'm currently running a campaign in my own contained world that technically doesn't have those planes, either. I haven't even really considered the issues around that and I don't plan to unless something specific comes up. There is so much more to work on that creating contingencies for every possible thing is not a good use of my worldbuilding/storybuilding/encounterbuilding time.



            It'll be a process



            Authors can spend their lifetimes building and filling out their universe. As GMs, we often don't have that luxury - especially if our players are itching to get started.



            What you need to do is fill in enough to get you started. Have your main story arc(s) outlined as well as your primary and motivating characters. But you're going to have to be flexible. Your players are going to change it, and you should let them and listen to them. Let them influence you and help build the world they are playing in. It'll likely lead to greater table satisfaction - and they're going to come up with ideas you probably wouldn't have :) And their actions can introduce new characters you hadn't thought of or new regions/worlds/planes interactions that you didn't consider.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$



            It's impossible to cover every scenario



            You are trying to create a homebrew universe, which is awesome. I wouldn't worry too much about trying to cover all your bases but just deal with issues as they come up.



            Building an entire universe is incredibly difficult, so don't worry about covering most cases (because you probably can't.) Worry more about building an engaging world and working on inconsistencies as they come up.



            My own world and time management



            I'm currently running a campaign in my own contained world that technically doesn't have those planes, either. I haven't even really considered the issues around that and I don't plan to unless something specific comes up. There is so much more to work on that creating contingencies for every possible thing is not a good use of my worldbuilding/storybuilding/encounterbuilding time.



            It'll be a process



            Authors can spend their lifetimes building and filling out their universe. As GMs, we often don't have that luxury - especially if our players are itching to get started.



            What you need to do is fill in enough to get you started. Have your main story arc(s) outlined as well as your primary and motivating characters. But you're going to have to be flexible. Your players are going to change it, and you should let them and listen to them. Let them influence you and help build the world they are playing in. It'll likely lead to greater table satisfaction - and they're going to come up with ideas you probably wouldn't have :) And their actions can introduce new characters you hadn't thought of or new regions/worlds/planes interactions that you didn't consider.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited 4 hours ago









            KorvinStarmast

            82.5k20257444




            82.5k20257444










            answered 7 hours ago









            NautArchNautArch

            61.1k8219406




            61.1k8219406











            • $begingroup$
              I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago
















            • $begingroup$
              I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago











            • $begingroup$
              @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
              $endgroup$
              – NautArch
              6 hours ago










            • $begingroup$
              I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
              $endgroup$
              – PixelMaster
              6 hours ago















            $begingroup$
            I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
            $endgroup$
            – PixelMaster
            6 hours ago




            $begingroup$
            I appreciate your advice, but I generally have a hard time with "just-roll-with-it-approaches". I don't know if it's because I tend to perfectionist or for some other reason, but I feel insecure and uncomfortable DMing a story without a decent, overarching theme/goal; in other words, when I start the campaign, I need to know the end goal / villain / etc. of the first "arc" (arc equals tiers of play here), and at least have a rough idea of possibilities for subsequent arcs. part 1/2 ...
            $endgroup$
            – PixelMaster
            6 hours ago












            $begingroup$
            ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
            $endgroup$
            – PixelMaster
            6 hours ago





            $begingroup$
            ... part 2/2: Since I'm also fond of the general concept of planes, the second act is likely to involve extraplanar entities. Since I'd like to at least hint towards the second arc during the first, I need / want to have the planes figured out. tl;dr I want my story neatly integrated with the world, and don't want to run into inconsistencies due to world elements not having been thought about for too long.
            $endgroup$
            – PixelMaster
            6 hours ago













            $begingroup$
            @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
            $endgroup$
            – NautArch
            6 hours ago





            $begingroup$
            @PixelMaster That's kind of a different question - and I'm sure we can help with that as well. Unfortunately, I do think that what your'e getting at may be idea generation needs and better suited to a forum (or maybe to worldbuilding SE). FIguring out how to make your world work with your story is going to be very much opinion-based and idea generation.
            $endgroup$
            – NautArch
            6 hours ago













            $begingroup$
            @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
            $endgroup$
            – NautArch
            6 hours ago




            $begingroup$
            @PixelMaster But you can try and present a problem of story vs plane/world and see if it's possible to answer here.
            $endgroup$
            – NautArch
            6 hours ago












            $begingroup$
            I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
            $endgroup$
            – PixelMaster
            6 hours ago




            $begingroup$
            I don't feel like I need to ask a question about that. I simply desire a solid foundation (in terms of world lore) to work with, but that's just me, it's not D&D-exclusive. Furthermore, I enjoy building a world, and I don't want to have to rush it later because the ongoing sessions demand it.
            $endgroup$
            – PixelMaster
            6 hours ago

















            draft saved

            draft discarded
















































            Thanks for contributing an answer to Role-playing Games Stack Exchange!


            • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

            But avoid …


            • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

            • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

            Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


            To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




            draft saved


            draft discarded














            StackExchange.ready(
            function ()
            StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2frpg.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f143972%2fwhat-are-the-ramifications-of-creating-a-homebrew-world-without-an-astral-plane%23new-answer', 'question_page');

            );

            Post as a guest















            Required, but never shown





















































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown

































            Required, but never shown














            Required, but never shown












            Required, but never shown







            Required, but never shown







            -

            Popular posts from this blog

            Are there any comparative studies done between Ashtavakra Gita and Buddhim?How is it wrong to believe that a self exists, or that it doesn't?Can you criticise or improve Ven. Bodhi's description of MahayanaWas the doctrine of 'Anatta', accepted as doctrine by modern Buddhism, actually taught by the Buddha?Relationship between Buddhism, Hinduism and Yoga?Comparison of Nirvana, Tao and Brahman/AtmaIs there a distinction between “ego identity” and “craving/hating”?Are there many differences between Taoism and Buddhism?Loss of “faith” in buddhismSimilarity between creation in Abrahamic religions and beginning of life in Earth mentioned Agganna Sutta?Are there studies about the difference between meditating in the morning versus in the evening?Can one follow Hinduism and Buddhism at the same time?Are there any prohibitions on participating in other religion's practices?Psychology of 'flow'

            Image
            Why "be dealt cards" rather than "be dealing cards"? Have I saved too much for retirement so far? The plural of 'stomach" How do I rename a LINUX host without needing to reboot for the rename to take effect? What defines a dissertation? Why are on-board computers allowed to change controls without notifying the pilots? Bash method for viewing beginning and end of file Student evaluations of teaching assistants Opposite of a diet Go Pregnant or Go Home Valid Badminton Score? What's the purpose of "true" in bash "if sudo true; then" What is the intuitive meaning of having a linear relationship between the logs of two variables? The baby cries all morning Is there a good way to store credentials outside of a password manager? Can I use my Chinese passport to enter China after I acquired another citizenship? Why Were Madagascar and New Zealand Discovered So Late? What are the ramifications of creating a ...
            Read more

            Where else does the Shulchan Aruch quote an authority by name?Parashat Metzora+HagadolPesach/PassoverShulchan Aruch UTF-8Anonymous glosses in the Shulchan AruchWhy is the Shulchan Aruch definitive?Siman 32, Kitzur Shulchan Aruch: UntranslatedLitvaks/Yeshivish and Shulchan AruchBuying a Shulchan AruchEnglish version of SHULCHAN ARUCHIs there any place where Shulchan Aruch rules with the Rosh against the Rif and Rambam?Are there practices where Sepharadim do not hold by Shulchan Aruch?5th part of the shulchan aruch

            Image
            Landlord wants to switch my lease to a "Land contract" to "get back at the city" Was there ever an axiom rendered a theorem? Finding files for which a command fails Is Social Media Science Fiction? What does "enim et" mean? Are objects structures and/or vice versa? Is every set a filtered colimit of finite sets? Doomsday-clock for my fantasy planet "My colleague's body is amazing" Why do UK politicians seemingly ignore opinion polls on Brexit? Does bootstrapped regression allow for inference? Is it legal to have the "// (c) 2019 John Smith" header in all files when there are hundreds of contributors? Is there a familial term for apples and pears? How did the USSR manage to innovate in an environment characterized by government censorship and high bureaucracy? I see my dog run How to make payment on the internet without leaving a money trail? Could a US political party gain complete control over the go...
            Read more

            fallocate: fallocate failed: Text file busy in Ubuntu 17.04? Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)defragmenting and increasing performance of old lubuntu system with swap partitionIssue with increasing the root partition from the swapthis /usr/bin/dpkg returned error || ubuntu-16.04, 64bitDefault 17.04 swap file locationHow to Resize Ubuntu 17.04 Zesty Swap file size?Ubuntu freezes from online formsMy Laptop is not starting after upgrade ubuntu 16.04 (Kernel 4.8.0-38 to 04.10.0-36)hcp: ERROR: FALLOCATE FAILED!Not sure my swap is being usedWine 3.0 asking for more virtual free swap

            Image
            Why does Python start at index 1 when iterating an array backwards? Letter Boxed validator What's the purpose of writing one's academic bio in 3rd person? What is the longest distance a 13th-level monk can jump while attacking on the same turn? What are 'alternative tunings' of a guitar and why would you use them? Doesn't it make it more difficult to play? Can Pao de Queijo, and similar foods, be kosher for Passover? When -s is used with third person singular. What's its use in this context? Right-skewed distribution with mean equals to mode? Should gear shift center itself while in neutral? Are my PIs rude or am I just being too sensitive? When is phishing education going too far? If 'B is more likely given A', then 'A is more likely given B' List *all* the tuples! Is high blood pressure ever a symptom attributable solely to dehydration? Is there a service that would inform me whenever a new direct route is scheduled ...
            Read more